In the music industry, friends and partners have chosen completely diverse routes. They sang together on a single from Charliโs new album, โCrash,โ on the importance of their friendship.
Charli XCX was in the doldrums as she prepared to release โCrash,โ the glossiest album of her career as a solo pop artist. In December, the British singer and songwriter landed a high-stakes โSaturday Night Liveโ performance with Caroline Polachek and Christine and the Queens, two of her friends and collaborators.
The whole project was cancelled hours before takeoff due to the Omicron surge, after a maze of planning, rehearsal, and boomerang travel. Charli XCX spun out as she navigated this interruption and other significant issues about what might come next. โIn January, I was really, really down, and pretty depressed, and I was sobbing a lot and questioning a lot of things,โ she added.
The cloud eventually lifted, and her public boldness came into play. She tweeted last week, โMy album is really fantastic.โ โItโs true, I canโt help myself.โ โCrash,โ which was published on Friday, is Charli XCXโs fifth and last album under the major label contract she signed when she was 16 years old. She became more creative after breaking through in 2014 with the single โBoom Clapโ and earning a reputation as a hooky, hit-making composer for other artists, straying towards hyperpop with Sophie and A.G. Cook, as evidenced by her 2017 mixtape โPop 2.โ But she never lost her desire to work with others.
Polachek, a lifelong friend, described her as โthe queen of features.โ Christine and the Queens, the French musician Hรฉlรถise Letissier, better known as Chris, are featured on โNew Shapes,โ a synthy single from โCrash,โ in which each contributed a poem about relationships, a topic theyโve talked in DMs and on podcasts for a long time. โI believe we all fall in love in our own unique way,โ Charli remarked.
According to her, the relationship tracks on โCrashโ may serve as a narrative about Charli XCXโs ups and downs in the music industry. She intended for the album to be her final, most polished attempt at pop stardom, just to see whether she could pull it off. โFor me, thereโs always been this eternal issue of, like, could I be the worldโs biggest artist, or am I not made for it?โ she added. โAm I too strange, too left, too opinionated, too unlikable, too different-looking, anything, whatever?โ
This month, Charli XCX had a rescheduled appearance on โS.N.L.,โ albeit without her companions. Sheโs now considering her options for the next step of her career. โWhat will I become?โ says the narrator. What will I appear to be? What am I going to wear? โHow will it sound?โ she wondered.
When Charli XCX, Polachek, and Chris came together in December to talk about recording and performing together across continents, transformation and evolution were constant themes. As Polachek, formerly of the Brooklyn indie band Chairlift, put it: โThey each approach music from different lanes.โ Chris, who has just been locked up in Los Angeles working on a new Christine and the Queens record, arrives with a headier theatrical and performance background; Charli on the social media-fueled pop front (she started on Myspace). โI enjoy composing music on my alone, but I feel that when I share a place with them, I really come alive,โ Charli remarked.
They discussed their professions and friendships, as well as why they work effectively as collaborators, in joint and separate interviews. โYou know, weโre feelers,โ Polachek explained. The following are edited transcripts of the discussions.
โI roll my eyes when people point to female pop vocalists as an example of change in music,โ Polachek said. CreditโฆJingyu Lin for The New York Times
How They Met
POLACHEK Charli and I met in Australia 12 years ago. I was singing from behind the band, playing double-decker synths โ I wasnโt even the lead singer of that band. And Charli was stomping onstage while singing over an iPod and wearing platform sneakers that were about a foot high and had rainbow stripes. The paradigms were diametrically opposed. Caroline, I want you to produce music for me, she said. Iโd never made music for anyone before, let alone myself, at the time.
CHARLI XCXย I remember watching Chairlift perform and Carolineโs vocals being incredible, and I think I was just really in awe of her. And I still am. I felt intimidated by her coolness, not that she was an intimidating person. She was really kind. I was maybe 18, and still traveling back and forth on trips from my parentsโ house.
POLACHEKย I did a mega-story Instagram post when Chris put outย the โGirlfriendโ video, I was just blown away by it, and I think you responded to that story and said, โIโm a fanโ and I was like, โIโm a fan.โ We had a pen pal relationship for about a year and a half, and quite a deep one, before we actually met. Just on Instagram DM. We were talking about love and pain.
CHRISย I can go deep with you in conversation, and I appreciate that in our friendship.
โThe truth is, Iโm allowed to be whoever I want, because the reason Iโm an interesting artist is because I evolve and change,โ Charli XCX said.CreditโฆJingyu Lin for The New York Times
On Gender in the Music Industry
CHARLI XCXย Now, and for the past however many years, Iโve loved co-writing. I see it as a real skill to be able to hone multiple peopleโs ideas into one sensical thing. But what I did experience [from outsiders] was a sense of disbelief that I could possibly write a song. Maybe thatโs a lack of education in the minutiae of the music industry and the different roles โ the songwriter; the producer; the artist who sometimes doubles as both. I think thereโs still a narrative of people being like, oh, did Olivia Rodrigo really write that song? Or did Taylor Swift?
Like, it seems that there needs to be this question around womenโs validity and whether theyโre worth their space, whereas it just doesnโt really seem to be a question for men.
POLACHEKย I roll my eyes when people point to female pop vocalists as an example of change in music. No. Womenโs faces and womenโs voices have been prominent since the beginning of pop music. Itโs who has their hand on the dial. Thatโs whatโs changing.
CHARLI XCXย There are more ways to be an artist because there are more platforms โ thereโs TikTok, thereโs SoundCloud. Thereโs being that girl in your bedroom, releasing songs and organically building a fan base via your own memes. Those things are all true, but unfortunately, and maybe call me a pessimist, I do feel like there are still boxes that women are supposed to fit in.
And there are definitely moments that break that mold โ Billie Eilish becoming the biggest artist in the world. A great artist creates an amazing world for people to access. I feel like people sometimes are not willing to accept that women artists evolve. Billie didย a performance using Auto-Tune, and the world imploded. And itโs like, thatโsย an artistic choice.
Iโm the weird girl on the fringes who made โPop 2โ and people loved me for that, and Iโm eternally grateful for that support. That helped me sustain a career that, post-2014 to 2015, wasnโt very commercially successful. I found a new lease on life playing closer to the underground, more avant-garde sounds. Maybe this is just the Twitter discourse, which I probably need to get my head out of, but sometimes it feels like Iโm being told, no, youโre not allowed to be anyone other than that. And really, the truth is, Iโm allowed to be whoever I want, because the reason Iโm an interesting artist is because I evolve and change.
CHRISย Iโm off social, stopped in July. My mental health is better. My connection to the present is better. I think social sometimes โ when itโs hyper-filtered and it needs to be punchy, catchy, immediately digestible โ itโs encouraging something that Iโm not always understanding myself, as an artist. Sometimes I want to take more time to express an idea.
My journey with gender has always been tumultuous. Itโs raging right now, as Iโm just exploring what is beyond this. A way to express it could be switching between they and she. I kind of want to tear down that system that made us label genders in such a strict way. I remember talking about being pansexual in France in 2014 โ it was a conversation that few opened up, and I was advised in, like, offices to maybe tone it down. Iโm really trying to address it the right way now, and Iโve been sometimes pressured to give an answer. But I think the answer is to be flickery, fluid, escaping.
I donโt want to rush that conversation, and I might never answer again. But in my work Iโm finding ways to make that journey joyful. I believe the real gestures are artistic, because the real discussion on queerness is also a discussion about the society we live in, about capitalism, about social justice. Itโs not just about me every morning wondering, am I masculine or feminine? Itโs all-encompassing.
On What They Value in Each Other as Artists
POLACHEKย Chris has a sense of velocity and total commitment. Most people when theyโre in rehearsal mode, they do things at 50 percent energy because you donโt want to wear yourself out, youโre just doing it for your brain. Chris is at like 100 percent, 150 percent, every single time, and just raises the level of commitment and energy flow for everyone around.
CHRISย Iโve been a fan of Caroline forever. I like how artistic everything is, how intentional everything is. There is an elegance, itโs demanding, but also super melodic.
CHARLI XCXย I think Caroline sees the potential for pop music to be anything that she can mold. She can create and make it sound or look or do anything that she wants, because she has all the skill set to do that.
With Caroline and Chris sometimes, honestly, Iโm just envious of their music. When I heard โGirlfriend,โ I was like, God, I want to work with [Christineโs collaborator] Dรขm-Funk. And I did and I was like, I donโt have this magical connection with this person, even though heโs amazing. Like, I wish Chris was here to figure this out for me.
CHRISย Charli, I relate very deeply toย youย writing the song. I can tell that youโre making music with what you experienced and the feeling you go through. There is something very earnest about your writing.
CHARLI XCXย Well, you were sort of my therapist for a while. You give good advice.
Especially over the past couple of years, Iโve been able to turn to both of them for a lot of personal things outside of music, and also, personal things that connect to music. Sometimes I think itโs hard, being an artist, to vocalize that youโre having a hard time, because obviously, weโre so lucky to be able sustain ourselves from the things that we create. But also, everyone has struggles. Itโs nice to speak with others who are in the same kind of situation as you, to confide in them about things that they get. Iโm really, really grateful for that.